Thursday, April 28, 2011

Recent News

To start, I sure am glad I don't have a PSN account about now. And, as a onetime victim of identity theft, I feel for everyone who's data has been stolen. I'm not going to make cracks at Sony for flipping a shit when /their/ data is compromised, and not even having the decency to apologize when it's your data that's misappropriated.

And to anyone who thinks I was involved in any way with this, I'm not crazy, and would prefer to not have the FBI knocking on my door. Running homebrew and exploring security on your devices is cool, hacking into someone elses server and stealing databases of user info is not cool. You make the hacking community look bad, even if it is aimed at douches like Sony.

One of the things I was contemplating back in early January was a PSN alternative, a place for jailbroken consoles to download homebrew and game without messing up anyone else's experience. Unfortunately events led me off of that path, but gamers, if I had succeeded you would have an alternative place to game online with your PS3 right now. I'm one of the good guys. I used to play games online on PC, I hated cheaters then and I hate them now.

Also, let's not fault the Sony engineers for this, the same way I do not fault the engineers who designed the BMG rootkit. The fault lies with the executives who declared a war on hackers, laughed at the idea of people penetrating the fortress that once was Sony, whined incessantly about piracy, and kept hiring more lawyers when they really needed to hire good security experts. Alienating the hacker community is not a good idea.

Now until more information is revealed on the technicals, I can only speculate, but I bet Sony's arrogance and misunderstanding of ownership put them in this position. Sony execs probably haughtily chuckled at the idea of threat modeling. Traditionally the trust boundary for a web service exists between the server and the client. But Sony believes they own the client too, so if they just put a trust boundary between the consumer and the client(can't trust those pesky consumers), everything is good. Since everyone knows the PS3 is unhackable, why waste money adding pointless security between the client and the server? This arrogance undermines a basic security principle, never trust the client. It's the same reason MW2 was covered in cheaters, Infinity Ward even admitted to the mistake of trusting Sony's client. Sony needs to accept that they no longer own and control the PS3 when they sell it to you. Notice it's only PSN that gave away all your personal data, not Xbox Live when the 360 was hacked, not iTunes when the iPhone was jailbroken, and not GMail when Android was rooted. Because other companies aren't crazy.

And let's talk about Sony's use of the word illegal. It is illegal, criminally so, to break into someone else's servers. But when the same word is used to refer to streaming a song from a non RIAA approved website, or to *gasp* playing a homebrew game on your PS3, respect for the word and those who say it is lost.

Weighing in quickly on the whole hacker vs cracker thing. I am a hacker. Whoever did this were hackers also. The media will never start using the word cracker. To me, a hacker is just somebody with a set of skills; hacker is to computer as plumber is to pipes. And the same ethics should apply, if you want to mess with the pipes in your own house, go for it. But don't go breaking into people's houses and messing with their pipes. (Note that I do not endorse water piracy)

To the perpetrator, two things. You are clearly talented and will have plenty of money(or a jail sentence and bankruptcy) coming to you in the future. Don't be a dick and sell people's information. And I'd love to see a write up on how it all went down...lord knows we'll never get that from Sony, noobs probably had the password set to '4' or something. I mean, at least it was randomly generated.

238 Comments:

«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 238 of 238
Blogger 852derek852 said...

@geohot also, if you ever decide to start a consulting company, call it Geohotz Consulting - You could publish jailbreaks for devices of companies that didn't consult with you. Yeah, it'd kind of be selling out, but holy shit you'd make so much money

May 4, 2011 at 2:58 PM  
Blogger adnan786 said...

this fuking hacker has seriously spoilt everything asshole

May 4, 2011 at 4:42 PM  
Blogger thee.boss said...

Hotz getting the goods out of the PS3 had nothing to do with PSN's breech. if Hotz wouldn't have gotten the keys someone else would've. all systems have holes, and enough monkeys banging on the keys will eventually type up the directions to find the hole. To blame Hotz for PSN going down by saying "You inspired this" is like saying Ozzy Osbourne's music causes teens to commit suicide (Slightly dating myself here ^_^). blame the kid who threw the brick through the window, don't blame the kids playing in the sandbox.

May 5, 2011 at 12:11 AM  
Blogger Ron said...

GeoHotz: I hope the ruling goes in your favor.

Community: Nothing is free. If GeoHotz gets the homebrew HPSN up, he will need a source of revenue to support it. Either through some sort of marketing in the HPSN home world or something. Then he would also have a challeng of spoofing the HPSN Identity over to other maunfactures of games like EA so you can play bought games in the HPSN enviroment. I think if HPSN becomes a profitable reality (because who ever is supporting it would need funds to update/repair) larger vendors would make allowences in their software or said software would also need to be hacked to access homebrew game servers.

Big Tasks that makes the end product costly, never mind the bandwidth needed to support the community.

May 5, 2011 at 12:37 PM  
Blogger Ron said...

There are a whole lot of assumptions flying around.

From what we know... Nothing has been taken.
The "Hakers" did not take PSN down, Sony admittedly brought it down on their own.

From my point of view, if I buy something, it's mine and I can do what ever I want to do with it. If I buy a PC and want to install another OS on it, I can. If I hook up to Sony's server and download a patch that disables the other OS, well I did that too. The only thing I have to do is not download SOny's patch and I am OK.

GeoHotz says, "Hey Sony, you guys have a flaw.... Look here it is", Sony does nothing to prevent the warned tampering and then someone follows up and tampers with PSN.... That is all on Sony. It's funny how they say that they are having these Security Experts come in to find out what went wrong when a simple Google search would of gave them an answer.

For all we know, the prankster that dropped the message on Sony's server did us all a huge favor and now our data will be a little (?) more secure when PSN comes back up.

May 5, 2011 at 1:19 PM  
Blogger yuri said...

please geo

May 6, 2011 at 6:57 AM  
Blogger Kreationz said...

Who fault is the current PSN outage? Sony. Why?

The compromised servers consisted of servers running outdated (read full of known holes) Apache software and NO firewall. Anyone here not update their anti-virus, OS or other system critical software? (It's likely auto-updated for most) Anyone here not behind a firewall? (Anyone with a router likely has one and they are on by default)

Don't believe me?
http://www.gamepro.com/article/news/219218/sony-was-using-outdated-software-prior-to-psn-breach

May 7, 2011 at 7:02 PM  
Blogger Killerhappy said...

@Kreationz: Yeah, sure... gamepro, huh?

May 7, 2011 at 11:42 PM  
Blogger Kreationz said...

They got the info from a U.S. Congressional hearing investigating the breach. It's public record. What news outlet would you consider a reputable source?

The actual sworn testimony video:
Link to Official Webcast (Broken 404 Error): http://energycommerce.edgeboss.net/wmedia/energycommerce/commerce/CMT050411.wvx
Working YouTube link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2P58L1deENg

It's almost 2 hours long, but Spafford's 1st part starts at ~22:45 and lasts about 5 minutes. At ~54:20-56:30 they discuss what he says in his written report about the outdated software and how he got the info.

May 8, 2011 at 1:34 AM  
Blogger luenardi said...

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1067967&page=2

May 8, 2011 at 12:30 PM  
Blogger Elliott said...

I'm not certain why most of you are incapable of understanding that this is not George Hotz' "fault". It is simply a technical impossibility. By the same logic, you could say that I caused a tsunami by eating a peanut butter sandwich.

May 10, 2011 at 11:39 AM  
OpenID hey dude said...

I guess the only person on the entire planet with the intelligence and skill set to hack the ps3 is geohot. No one else would of ever figured it out. We should all bow down to the greatness that is Geohot. Lowly humans beware the wrath of a true god.
Okay all kidding aside, anyone who blames Geohot for psn being down is not a smart person. You can no more blame geohot for this then you could blame the Wright brothers for 9/11. I mean if they hadn't made that first flight then no one would of figured out how to make an air plane that could fly long distances.

May 11, 2011 at 1:35 AM  
Blogger Adam said...

While I won't play the blame game. but still Hotz, you really made things difficult for yourself, just a little foresight could of saved you all that harrassment.

It was all fine when you were jailbreaking your playstation and kept it to yourself. As far as I am aware, Sony doesn't come round visting their customers homes to make sure they haven't messed with their console. But then you shared your information online...

You must of known that Sony would of not approved. You ticked the user agreement terms when you switched on the console did you not? you therefore should of been aware of those terms. Not only did you violated those terms but you went told the world about it. Which part of this seemed like a good idea at the time?

also didn't it occur to you that people could take your information that you shared and use then modify it for more sinister intentions? Whenever that was what happened or not, it still woulden't of looked good for you either way. When an hack happens, they are going to look for the source of that hacking. A guy who recently shared jailbreaking information online in defiance of the sony user agreement terms is going to look very suspect no matter how you look at. Was it really that much of a surprise that they came knocking at your door?

May 30, 2011 at 7:41 PM  
Blogger Jilly said...

Got tired of reading about people crying that "Everything from the first OtherOS hack until the end of time is your fault, George!!!" and scrolled down to post that despite their insistence to the opposite, this isn't All Your Fault™, though I'm sure you're aware of that as you aren't an unintellegent sack of shit, like ArronC07, who apparently can't separate your actions from the past events to every even until the earth dies.

What ArronC07 fails to realize is that if he weren't such a piece of shit and actually examined his own logic, yes, actions do have consequences. Removing OtherOS had consequences. Abusing the legal system had consequences. Embodying "Might makes Right" had consequences. Pissing of vast amounts of people HAD CONSEQUENCES.

When Sony infected PC of its customers with rootkits, nothing was done to them. As a result, no one outside of the niche of tech site readers knew about it or cared enough to care about it. Sony continued on, without consequence and without changing how they operated. This time it was different. This time Sony was not only scolded, Sony had its necks grabbed, and its face shoved against the concrete. It was a long time coming, to be honest. It's what happens when the law fails to curb the wrongs being done because the laws favor these multinational megacorporations (and even the governments themselves, as seen by revolutions in the middle east.)

Hopefully, not only Sony learns from this. And, hopefully, this is not the end of corrections that direly need to take place in this world.

June 9, 2011 at 10:10 PM  
Blogger Jilly said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

June 9, 2011 at 10:10 PM  
Blogger freetheps3 said...

@George http://www.petitionbuzz.com/petitions/freetheps3 hope you sign this other people will to it is unfair i am willing to make a move against sony i hope you will to.

June 19, 2011 at 11:17 AM  
Blogger urahara72 said...

Hey Geohot, I love that you are talking about a PSN Alternative, because I know a guy who's got one starting up! Right now it is only for PSP's and has one game server XD

He's got Gods Eater Burst running online with open server access in beta testing :)
If you haven't already, Check out his blog at www.coldbird.uk.to

When opensource devs work together, great stuff happens ;D So if you could get up with him and get this going even faster, I'm sure he and everyone awaiting full release with bated breath (me) would greatly appreciate any help you can give :D

June 20, 2011 at 12:07 AM  
Blogger urahara72 said...

www.coldbird.uk.to

check it out, PSN alternative up and coming betches! lol coldbird is awesome! he's got Gods Eater Burst online off of sony's servers. If you could help out at all, I'm sure he and all of those hoping this works out (me especially) would appreciate anything you could do to help get it off the ground!

June 20, 2011 at 12:15 AM  
Blogger urahara72 said...

sorry bout the double post

June 20, 2011 at 12:19 AM  
Blogger thefree said...

These people, as well as the criminals who breached Sony's PlayStation Network security with the intent on causing harm to others for nothing more than their own capitalist gains, are the people who destroy and subvert our great nation and wreak ungodly havoc on the world for THEIR own selfish and devastating ends. I hope to see that the people like the ones I named will have to stand and defend themselves in our courts for their crimes against America. And I pray that they will be convicted of their crimes and be given the swiftest and righteous penalties we can assess to these terrorists. Thanks for sharing.
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OpenID 101329f0-0706-11e1-9ecb-000bcdcb2996 said...

I agree with what george has been saying about these other hackers.It has nothing to do with him, but the irresponsible idiots who think they can pull shit like that and make it seem okay to make people hate what they don't understand. I have no problem with hackers. They make the world a better place and make our tech safer, believe it or not, but it's those assholes who take it a step further and make things LESS enjoyable for the rest of us who give hackers a bad name.

November 4, 2011 at 12:57 PM  
Blogger XxXiAmYoUrPuNiShErXxX said...

@george hotz
can you help me???
my ps3 is 3.73
and i want to downgrade
do you know anyway how to do it???

November 6, 2011 at 9:29 AM  
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February 1, 2012 at 4:15 PM  
OpenID 0389f4e8-6b5b-11e1-a5b3-000bcdcb471e said...

Hate to be the last to post but something told me to say this...

For those of you playing the blame game why don't just get to the root of the problem. a.) It is all God’s (or some other higher being depending on your religion) fault for making man. b.)It is the Big Bang's Fault for creating a world that somehow resulted in the creation of Humans. That being said I just have one thought... how many of the bashers are using or own Jailbroken/Rooted phones or other devices? Is that a hint of Irony I smell? Just because a judge ruled jailbreaking a mobile device is legal, that doing it on a ps3 is not? Am I the only one that thinks this is a bit "two faced"?

And for the ones that say it would not have happened unless it was for Holt, you I am sorry to say are mistaken there are other companies (I will not post names because SECA watching this blog) have done jailbreaks without Holt's Code. Anyway a question to Mr. Holt, (if you are allowed to answer) did you admit using the OS to get the code, or did you get it another way? I was just wondering because it could have been gotten other ways, and most people with knowledge of electronics should know that.

The other thing is please do your research before blaming people. There have been groups that attack businesses for years now some with some without inspiration. If you want to be so naive and believe that your information has never been stolen then that’s your right. I myself know of 3 times some of my information could have been compromised. You want to find something really scary Google search businesses that have had their data compromised. That will really get you paranoid.

Last but not least my views. (Oh no here it goes) I personally believe that we should be entitled to what we paid for. I do not buy a television and years later let the company take out the Menu to adjust the settings or input. For those of you who think this is not relevant get with the times there are televisions out there with for lack of a better term "Operating System".(web browsing TV’s, ect)

If I wanted to Jailbreak my PS3 shouldn't I have the right to? I paid a lot of money for it. I upgraded the parts that were not "up to my standards". Should I not be able to customize it how I wish? Think about this: If you bought a car and the car company told you that you could not customize anything on that car ever what would your response be to them? Now ask the same question about SCEA. We should be able to do whatever we want to with our property as long as we do not do Illegal acts with it. Go after the ones doing the piracy and leave the rest alone. Trying to blame Holt for people using his ideals to play pirated games how can you justify this? They can still do it without his method. More to the point it’s not SCEA's business anyway. Playing a pirated game would be the game maker’s business would it not? Who would sue you for having pirated material: The DVD player manufacturer, or the company that made the film? Last time I checked Phillips was not suing anyone for copyright infringement.

I do not believe that people should hack web servers to gain access to data or any other type of attack. I personally believe that unless someone can provide evidence that Mr. Holt had anything to do with the hack itself then bite your tongue before you accuse this is how people get hurt. There are already too many accusations without proof we do not need any more. Moreover do you not think that the government would not have him locked away if he was in any way associated with the Group in question? Recent activity has gotten them pretty far up the wanted list, and I for one would be afraid to be even remotely connected with said group.

Now that I have said my peace those that are set in their ways shall have a go at me.

March 11, 2012 at 5:21 AM  
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Blogger X said...

Given the amount of support you have GH, I think you have the right to win even if you were sued. I've always seen settlements as a kind of loss. Rudimentary bullying, in other words. Pay up your lunch money or we'll get big Ben for ya.

I still encourage you to find it within you to CHALLENGE Sony. Not amass people in hatred, because they will end up doing nothing anyway. Boycotting a full-fledged corporation will not work, they have too many revenue streams. So staying away from Sony products only means it will be something you consent to have never taken advantage of. It also shows immaculate compliance when dealing with threats.

There are aggressive ways to challenge Sony without breaking any laws (however stringent) as well as passive challenges. The real threat isn't Sony, and they apparently have no problem playing the scapegoat either. However moreso, it is the amount of laws constantly being made in accordance to corporate needs/plans/demands which subtly shift the legal environment-bubble we are "allowed" to live and consume within.

The changes aren't groundbreaking or even noticeable, however in effect we end up living in a world where corporations control the rights of the people, their decisions, thinking and lives.


Oh, and simple crimes like the one mentioned - should be dealt with as simple crimes. I see no need for protest. Whether he gets caught or finds another way to evade the law, it's just another way to consume valuable time.

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